Did
'The Play Ethic'
contribute anything to Scottish culture other than more landfill?

"The Play Ethic ought to be the most influential book by a Scot since R.D.Laing's The Divided Self - and I hope it will be; it's a long time since I've been jolted into thinking in so many different ways at the same time. Grand H.G. Wellsian argument, logically-constructed but bursting with ideas, pictures and conversations."
-- Christopher Harvie, author of No Gods and Precious Few Heroes, and Professor of British Studies at the University of Tubingen.
And you don't haver with The Harv. (Like The Hoff, only less... camp.) *Love* you!

Pat, what you say is all well and good, but as an ex-pat Scot I have grave reservations about the ability of the Scots to pull off independence with much aplomb. That's not to say I wouldn't like to see it happen, but if the SNP are the ones to help us achieve that, then God Help Us All!

What does it mean to be Scottish? It's a simple question, but there are no convincing answers to be heard. You say that to be British is toxic on the international stage - so is the sum total of being Scottish not being English or British? Apart from our foolishly misguided self-destructive streak, I believe the Scots can only define themselves by what they are not at this time. e.g. We're not English, we're not British, we're not great fans of Thatcher and so on ad nasuem. But what are we?

In my experience, what we are is invisible, but with an inflated sense of self and a sizable chip on our collective shoulder. Your average citizen of the world doesn't know anything about Scotland and has little interest in knowing about Scotland, and as soon as we start to harp on about being "not English" you can see poor Johnny Foreigners' eyes glaze over.

Before we talk about idependence, we need to talk about identity and the aspirations we want to have as a country. With a clear - and this is the important bit, positive sense of identity to call upon - then surely independence would follow logically, rather than looking likely to be the difficult birth of a bastard child.

The SNP - from my perspective - have neither the wit, wisdom or confidence to discuss identity. Instead they - like the Daily Record - neatly symbolise so much of what is wrong with Scotland at the moment. Chippy, insular, dour and opportunist.

Suntannedexile, I wouldn't disagree with you about the SNP. I'd go along with all those people who think it needs a culture-and-name-change - I prefer 'Scottish Progress' myself, have done for years. And yes, it's not sophisticated about Scottish identity - though it's slightly better than McConnell's thick-headed anti-Englishness in the World Cup this year (I wrote about this in my guardian blog earlier this year.). Independence - or maximum attainable self-government, which ever comes first - has to be exactly about the positive, non-defensive aspiration you suggest. But I must admit, the re-imposition of Trident, and the wasted opportunity for rebuilding Scottish society represented by our appropriate share of oil revenues (a la Norway), does make me feel a little 'defensive' about Scottish state sovereignty, even yet. Thanks for the exile's perspective (try to maintain an internal exile's perspective myself!).

Guys, what you say about horses and carts (I paraphrase slightly...) may well be true but surely all that will happen with this type of complex, identity based approach is that the intelligentsia spend hours, days, weeks and years discussing the best way around this, counting the numnber of tartan dolls on the head of a pin and meantime they get totally and utterly ignored by the electorate, who would and will never take any notice of their discourse anyway?

I'm not sure how to say this without seeming arrogant but most people in Scotland read The Sun and The Record and that is where they get a lot of their attitudes from.

Yes Scotland needs to stop defining itself around England and yes Scotland needs to be more outward looking and less self-mocking, but would independence not ensure that this happened anyway?

How many years do we have to go on discussing Scottish identity before we get to the point of taking our own destiny in our own hands. The posts from overseas are interesting, in the same way that it's interesting to hear the views of Pat: an old activist. But, to move the Independence Project along we need to start with an elected SNP administration in 2007.
Then and only then will the serious debate about Scotland's future options get under way.
Then it will be the time for bold and constructive people to take Scotland's side against the Brit Establishment onslaught.

I think the old adage needs to be updated. Substitute “….the last copy of the Scottish Sun and Daily Record “ for “…..the last copy of the Sunday Post”.
Scots are no different from the rest of the UK, in that they are lazy in matters of opinion formation.
Until that nationwide problem is addressed, the collective identity, and indeed the identity of individuals, will remain shrouded. Not in mystery, but in toxic sound bites, helpfully provided by journalism for the hard of thinking. Present company, obviously and honourably, excepted!

Scotland is a strange case; the vast majority of Scot's feel more Scottish than British and in opinion polls consistently show a desire for independence. However when it comes to the ballot box, the majority of people vote unionist Scottish Labour.

The unionist Scottish media is the key, especially the Daily Record and Scottish Sun who always back Labour. People forget how powerful mass media really is. The hapless, incompetent Jack McConnell is under pressure as the vibrant, credible SNP alternative increasingly looks like taking power next year. What does the Record say?

The Record's opinion column on Saturday was again warning of the dire consequences of independence. Moreover it pleaded not to punish Labour and "sleepwalk" into independence. How patronising! A referendum on the issue is not "sleepwalking"; every Scot will have the right to decide their country's future at last having never been allowed the opportunity.

However I fear that the zombified central belt masses will again choose Labour having read the unionist propoganda (lies)without thinking and "sleepwalk" into yet another decade of being a neglected sub-nation despite having the skills and resources to join our Celtic cousin as a small wealthy independent country making our own decisions.

Did Chris Harvie get his copy of 'The Play Ethic' in The Works at a very reasonable £1.99?

I ♥ you 2 wee man.

PS How are the paperback sales going?

Che, you are quite correct in your fear. The Unionist guns have not started firing their dangerous blanks yet.

Thankfully the Daily Record is in decline. We have to take the long term view. They are biased and even donate to the Labour Party so can be discounted when it comes to any sort of journalism.

When GB Brown gets in he be slaughtered by Cameron and we may even sleep walk into independence. I'm glad Labour are making it sound so easy. I can't wait to wake up the day after the sleep walk. Keep up the jokes boys, your quite laughable these days.

Pat, do take a moment to head over to the Guardian talkboards if you get a moment. Some of the contributors there have a wonderful thread that's been running in various guises for five years or more, but always with Kenneth McKellar in the name - look for it in 'Notes And Queries'.

You're regarded there as something of a star. We call you Pat 'Pat Kane' Kane; not because of what one or two naysayers claimed were your 'weapons-grade levels of self-absorption' - simply because it's nice to type your name twice.

The same couple of vagabonds described The Play Ethic as 'look-at-me w*nkery of the first water; page after page of strained-out effluvia, spattering the gleaming porcelain of humanity and filling your local remainder bin with eye-stinging wafts of acrid bumsteam. If you wish to avoid falling into a black hole of misanthropy from which not even 80s-soulboy-turned-money-for-old-rope-spouting-chubsters can escape, do not read this book'.

We told that lot to sling their hooks, of course - we think you're great.

Do visit, if you can.

Pat, do take a moment to head over to the Guardian talkboards if you get a moment. Some of the contributors there have a wonderful thread that's been running in various guises for five years or more, but always with Kenneth McKellar in the name - look for it in 'Notes And Queries'.

You're regarded there as something of a star. We call you Pat 'Pat Kane' Kane; not because of what one or two naysayers claimed were your 'weapons-grade levels of self-absorption' - simply because it's nice to type your name twice.

The same couple of vagabonds described The Play Ethic as 'look-at-me w*nkery of the first water; page after page of strained-out effluvia, spattering the gleaming porcelain of humanity and filling your local remainder bin with eye-stinging wafts of acrid bumsteam. If you wish to avoid falling into a black hole of misanthropy from which not even 80s-soulboy-turned-money-for-old-rope-spouting-chubsters can escape, do not read this book'.

We told that lot to sling their hooks, of course - we think you're great.

Do visit, if you can.

Ahem, So good he had to say it twice.

Dear Pat, I've tried to get a copy of 'The Play Ethic' in my local library, as I'm loathe to part with the sum of £1 and 99 pence in The Works for it. Sadly, my local librarian, Euphemia, claims that they do not have it on their system as it was deemed keech due to the deranged warblings of its author. Thankfully, they do have both volumes of your greatest hits.

Pip pip.